We recently sat down with Carey Nieuwhof in Nashville for what turned into one of the most challenging conversations we’ve had about the future of church production and worship. If you caught our earlier clips, you’ve already seen some highlights. Now here’s the full conversation, and honestly, it’s packed with insights that every worship leader and tech director needs to hear.
The Big Question: Are We Missing Something?
Carey opened with something that’s been on a lot of our minds: “Gen Z is the most marketed to generation in human history. And we’re all kind of numb to the production… I don’t think people are looking for hype. They’re looking for hope.”
That hit different.
We’ve spent the last 15 years helping churches level up their production quality. We’ve installed cutting-edge lighting systems, dialed in pristine audio mixes, and built content that reaches millions. But Carey’s pushing us to ask a harder question: What if great production isn’t enough anymore?
It’s Not About Ditching Your Gear
Before you panic and start selling your hazer on Facebook Marketplace, let me be clear: Carey’s not saying to abandon good production. His exact words: “You shouldn’t have bad lighting and bad sound and bad production and a bad band that can’t play to click.”
What he is saying? There’s a tonal shift happening right now in church culture.
“It’s paying attention, not just to whether the audience is paying attention, but what might God be doing in the room?” Carey explained. “Sometimes you see people, they grab a tissue and they start to cry or wives lean into their husbands… And then it’s like, okay, well, what is God doing there?”
The Liturgy Problem We’re Not Talking About
Here’s where the conversation got really interesting. I proposed that maybe this isn’t actually a production technology issue at all. Maybe it’s a liturgy issue.
“I think we are a little liturgically malnourished in the modern, evangelical, non-denom church,” I told Carey. “We get joy and praise pretty well in the modern church, but no contemplation or confession or lamentation or reflection.”
Carey agreed, and shared something that convicted me: “I realized as our liturgy shifted over the years and we became the classic attractional non-denominational church, that often prayer becomes just an opportunity to clear the set for the sermon… It’s basically a set change. And I look back on that now and I kind of regret it.”
When’s the last time you had an actual prayer of confession in your service? Not a transition prayer. A real, “God, we’ve made big mistakes this year” moment?
Creating Space (Without Making It Awkward)
One of the most practical parts of our conversation was about how to actually create space for encounter without making everyone uncomfortable. Matt, who’s been leading worship for 25+ years, asked the question a lot of younger worship leaders have: “How do they prepare for moments where they can sit in silence comfortably in front of hundreds, if not thousands of people?”
Carey’s answer was simple but powerful: “You know what? At the end of what I just said, you can say, ‘So here’s what we’re going to do. We’re going to release it and then we’re going to sing.’ And then you’re noodling or the pads are going or something like that and you just kind of noodle it and then the vocalist opens up and away you go.”
It doesn’t have to be dead silent. It doesn’t have to be clunky. It just has to be intentional.
The Live Streaming Debate
We got into a bit of a “beef” with Brady Shearer a few months ago about whether churches really need to live stream. Carey’s take? It depends on your production quality.
His analogy was brutal but honest: “A lot of churches, and these are well-meaning, beautiful Christian people. If you don’t have the talent in production or in worship, you sound like a school play.”
The threshold? Around 400-500 in attendance, you typically start having the talent base to do production well. Below that, consider just streaming the message, or posting it on-demand after you’ve mixed it properly.
But here’s the key insight: Online is the new foyer.
“I can’t remember a single time where somebody who was truly unchurched hadn’t watched us online for weeks or months or up to a year before trying us in person,” Carey shared. Unchurched people aren’t just showing up on Sunday morning anymore. They’re investigating you online first.
So yeah, you probably need something online. But it needs to be good enough that it doesn’t repel people.
The Cultural Moment We’re In
Carey believes we’re in a unique season right now: “I think the harvest is ripe and plentiful… there’s a lot of people who would consider themselves non-believers, but they’re way more warmed up to the idea of faith and are ready for that.”
His advice? Go deeper, faster. Don’t do intro 101 Christianity. People showing up now want meat, not milk.
“Give them meat. We want meat,” referencing Tara Lee Cobble’s work. “The gospel is fully known, fully loved. Often we think we cannot be fully known and have people fully love us… Well, you know what? God fully knows you. He sees the depth of your sin. He knows what happened last night… and he loves you.”
What This Means for Your Church Tech
So where does this leave us as people who help churches with production and technology?
- Don’t abandon quality – Bad production is still bad. People won’t come back if the audio is painful or the lights are distracting.
- Tools are neutral – Your hazer, your LED wall, your PTZ cameras – these aren’t the problem. They’re tools that can support whatever liturgy you’re creating.
- Service design matters more than you think – You have 52 blank canvases every year. Stop copying the same template week after week.
- Create space intentionally – This might mean trimming your sermon by 5 minutes. This might mean extending a worship moment. This might mean adding a prayer of confession.
- Your online presence is your new front door – If you’re going to stream, make it good. If you can’t make it good yet, at least make the message available.
For the Young Leaders
We also talked about navigating toxic church culture and what to do when you’re a tech director or worship pastor trying to move things forward but butting heads with senior leadership.
Carey’s advice was practical: Write down the actual issues you’re facing. Approach your pastor respectfully with the real constraints (budget, staffing, expertise). If they’re a healthy leader, they’ll work with you. If they’re toxic, you’ll know pretty quickly.
And if you’re interviewing for a new role? “Ask around. Don’t ask the pastor. Ask former staff if you can. Go on a trip together. Play golf. You’ll learn a lot when the flight gets delayed.”
The Bottom Line
As Carey put it: “We have more permission than we give ourselves.”
Permission to create space. Permission to go deeper. Permission to try something different on a Sunday that isn’t just three songs and a message.
The production matters. The technology matters. We’re not throwing any babies out with bathwater here at Churchfront. But maybe it’s time to ask: What are we producing this all for? Entertainment or encounter?
Watch the full conversation on our YouTube channel, and let us know: What’s one way you’re creating space for encounter in your worship services?Enter AI generated article.
